1 00:00:04,840 --> 00:00:09,955 To get into the details of how this new problem of justice is going to be settled, 2 00:00:09,955 --> 00:00:14,197 we have to get in the minds of what's happening inside of the trial. 3 00:00:14,384 --> 00:00:19,687 There are some strange twists and turns. And, I think it's worth us getting a sense 4 00:00:19,687 --> 00:00:24,740 of what's going on in this back and forth in the trial in order to get a grip on 5 00:00:24,740 --> 00:00:27,548 what's happening with these new institutions. 6 00:00:27,548 --> 00:00:31,104 The Olympians are going to be on the side of the new system, 7 00:00:31,104 --> 00:00:34,660 And this new system is going to be expressed in a courtroom. 8 00:00:34,660 --> 00:00:39,402 And, the old order is going to be the chronic divinities lined up with the 9 00:00:39,402 --> 00:00:43,587 Furies and their side of things. We'll see in the end of course the 10 00:00:43,587 --> 00:00:47,334 Olympians aren't going to win. but what happens to get us there? 11 00:00:47,334 --> 00:00:50,895 We've got this back and forth court case. Now, what's a stake? 12 00:00:51,082 --> 00:00:55,892 Well, first of all, I think we could appeal again to one of our universal laws. 13 00:00:56,079 --> 00:01:01,014 We've got universal law, I think it was number four that came up in a lecture some 14 00:01:01,014 --> 00:01:05,847 time ago, where we talked about the connection with leadership. since that 15 00:01:05,847 --> 00:01:10,634 every decisional leader has to make his, Never between one very good thing and one 16 00:01:10,634 --> 00:01:13,880 very bad thing. It's always between either two bad things 17 00:01:13,880 --> 00:01:17,126 or two good things. A leader has to figure out what to do 18 00:01:17,126 --> 00:01:21,340 based on those kind of hard choices. Well, it's also true that every choice, 19 00:01:21,340 --> 00:01:26,067 not just in a context of leadership, but I think every really tough choice a person 20 00:01:26,067 --> 00:01:29,427 faces is between two bad things or between two good things. 21 00:01:29,427 --> 00:01:34,211 It's always never the case as you get in Hollywood that there's some kind of simple 22 00:01:34,211 --> 00:01:38,937 choice between something that's obviously good and something else that's obviously 23 00:01:38,937 --> 00:01:41,215 bad. And the bad thing, somehow, works out 24 00:01:41,215 --> 00:01:43,458 better for you. So you selfishly take it. 25 00:01:43,625 --> 00:01:48,335 That's never the kind of moral dilemma that those of us who lived in the world 26 00:01:48,335 --> 00:01:51,894 for a while, face. Instead, what your face is always some 27 00:01:51,894 --> 00:01:55,907 really tough choice between two good things or two bad things. 28 00:01:55,907 --> 00:02:00,114 Well, this is definitely happening in the case of Orestes's trial. 29 00:02:00,114 --> 00:02:03,155 There are two bad things that being considered. 30 00:02:03,155 --> 00:02:08,462 We have to try to come to an understanding of whose murder is going to count most. 31 00:02:08,462 --> 00:02:11,828 Each side makes an attempt to talk about the murder. 32 00:02:11,828 --> 00:02:15,840 One of these murders as being more significant than the other. 33 00:02:15,840 --> 00:02:19,530 And so, trying to either exonerate Orestes or convict him. 34 00:02:19,530 --> 00:02:27,423 So, the question is boil down to a question of whether the husband murdering 35 00:02:27,423 --> 00:02:32,250 the wife is worse, Or whether the son murdering the mother is 36 00:02:32,250 --> 00:02:35,562 worse. So, we've got a husband murdering a wife 37 00:02:35,562 --> 00:02:39,738 on the one hand, And we've got a son murdering a mother on 38 00:02:39,738 --> 00:02:42,187 the other hand. Which one is worse? 39 00:02:42,187 --> 00:02:46,579 The trial comes down to a decision to try to figure that out. 40 00:02:46,795 --> 00:02:49,963 Apollo and the Furies are on opposite sides. 41 00:02:50,179 --> 00:02:53,420 Apollo downplays the mother/son relationship. 42 00:02:53,420 --> 00:02:58,103 Yeah, line 657 and forward. According to the popular concept that the 43 00:02:58,103 --> 00:03:03,579 mother is just a vessel for a man's seed and that she is not that important in the 44 00:03:03,579 --> 00:03:08,196 production of, of the offspring. Strange line of argument, but what he's 45 00:03:08,196 --> 00:03:13,474 trying to get at there is that the connection between the mother and the son 46 00:03:13,474 --> 00:03:17,366 is not all that important. He's downplaying that connection. 47 00:03:17,366 --> 00:03:22,445 So, in his eyes, what he's trying to say is that, when the son kills the mother, 48 00:03:22,445 --> 00:03:27,191 it's not as though some connection there is being terribly violated. 49 00:03:27,366 --> 00:03:32,096 That needs them to if we understand that, then Orestes's crime becomes less 50 00:03:32,096 --> 00:03:36,825 important because the connection between mother and son here is being severed, to 51 00:03:36,825 --> 00:03:40,446 say it's not so important. That's Apollo's line of argument. 52 00:03:40,446 --> 00:03:45,234 The Chorus, the Furies, on the other hand, as seen, there's a section of the argument 53 00:03:45,234 --> 00:03:49,905 in lines 605 and four that makes this clear, they argue that blood relations are 54 00:03:49,905 --> 00:03:53,292 what's most important. So, talking about the link between a 55 00:03:53,292 --> 00:03:55,920 husband and a wife, there's no blood involved. 56 00:03:55,920 --> 00:04:01,518 So, when a husband kills a wife or a wife kills a husband in this case, the problem 57 00:04:01,518 --> 00:04:06,775 there is, is not one that's so difficult. The connection that's being violated is 58 00:04:06,775 --> 00:04:09,642 not so close. There is no blood connection. 59 00:04:09,642 --> 00:04:14,285 On the other hand, the Furies say, when a mother, a son kills a mother, that's a 60 00:04:14,285 --> 00:04:18,859 violation of a blood connection. So, that crime, that murder, is worse. 61 00:04:18,859 --> 00:04:23,297 The argument boils down to which one are you going to value most. 62 00:04:23,297 --> 00:04:27,462 And for the Furies, it's the connection that's based on blood, 63 00:04:27,462 --> 00:04:32,466 And for the Olympians it's something else. It's a connection that is, based on a 64 00:04:32,466 --> 00:04:36,806 different kind of thing and doesn't just fall back on blood ties and blood 65 00:04:36,806 --> 00:04:39,583 connection. So, from this, let's make sure that we 66 00:04:39,583 --> 00:04:43,518 have that piece straight before we move into the next part of it. 67 00:04:43,692 --> 00:04:47,858 We're going to take a look at the historical background according to which 68 00:04:47,858 --> 00:04:52,083 this debate was being understood. You and I as ancient Athenians, we're 69 00:04:52,083 --> 00:04:55,764 standing out there watching Aeschylus put forward his drama. 70 00:04:55,764 --> 00:05:00,814 We've got this mythical, mythically insoluble problem inside of this family. 71 00:05:01,009 --> 00:05:05,152 Let's see what can happen. Well, it turns out that an institution 72 00:05:05,152 --> 00:05:10,203 that you and I, as classical Atenians know, well, is going to swoop in and solve 73 00:05:10,203 --> 00:05:12,340 this famously insolvable problem.