1
00:00:04,840 --> 00:00:09,241
The thing that I really want to
concentrate on in looking at the Agamemnon

2
00:00:09,241 --> 00:00:12,558
and throughout the Oresteia is the theme
of justice.

3
00:00:12,558 --> 00:00:16,003
It has entered into our treatment in the
Agamemnon.

4
00:00:16,003 --> 00:00:20,915
We talked about this problem that is
bouncing back and forth inside of

5
00:00:20,915 --> 00:00:23,913
Agamemnon's family tree in the house of
Atreus.

6
00:00:23,913 --> 00:00:27,485
How are we suppose to deal with this
problem of justice?

7
00:00:27,485 --> 00:00:32,971
We have prior past generations that have
committed horrible crimes that require

8
00:00:33,162 --> 00:00:36,862
revenge, but that revenge itself spurs
further retribution.

9
00:00:36,862 --> 00:00:41,663
So, we got a, a kind of curse or evil
that's stuck inside the family tree.

10
00:00:41,663 --> 00:00:46,069
The way to get it out is not obvious.
It's very hard to figure out how that is

11
00:00:46,069 --> 00:00:49,796
going to happen.
To get at this, we need to start to unpack

12
00:00:49,796 --> 00:00:53,129
some Greek concepts circling around the
idea of justice.

13
00:00:53,298 --> 00:00:57,816
This becomes especially apparent when we
compare how Homer treated the story or

14
00:00:57,816 --> 00:01:00,979
Orestes with how Aeschylus treats the
story of Orestes.

15
00:01:01,148 --> 00:01:05,780
Remember, Homer pulled this out for his
own uses as a way to help nudge Telemachus

16
00:01:05,780 --> 00:01:08,434
into action.
Saying, listen, even when things are

17
00:01:08,434 --> 00:01:12,162
really tough and you have to take revenge
against your own mother.

18
00:01:12,162 --> 00:01:14,787
And Orestes,
In this case, it's time for action.

19
00:01:14,787 --> 00:01:17,802
So, Homer focuses on that aspect of the
story.

20
00:01:17,802 --> 00:01:22,199
Very different with Aeschylus.
Instead, what we have is, gosh, look at

21
00:01:22,199 --> 00:01:25,277
this awful thing that's happening to this
family.

22
00:01:25,277 --> 00:01:29,434
The story that courses around Orestes in
the Agamemnon as the first installment,

23
00:01:29,434 --> 00:01:33,241
We're not going to be reading the Libation
Bearers for our part of the class.

24
00:01:33,241 --> 00:01:36,702
Although, I recommend that you read it on
your own as you have time.

25
00:01:36,702 --> 00:01:40,460
And then, we're going to read the final
installment the Eumenides or the Furies.

26
00:01:40,460 --> 00:01:43,773
In all these three plays, ideas of justice
are what's at the center.

27
00:01:43,773 --> 00:01:46,691
So, Orestes is faced with this incredibly
difficult problem.

28
00:01:46,691 --> 00:01:49,163
To try to right the wrongs that are in his
family.

29
00:01:49,163 --> 00:01:53,366
But then, how's he going to do it without
perpetuating the cycle of revenge that's

30
00:01:53,366 --> 00:01:57,421
built into this set of events.
The problem of justice here is a knotty

31
00:01:57,421 --> 00:01:59,349
one.
It's a very difficult one.

32
00:01:59,349 --> 00:02:03,656
It's famously difficult.
How are we going to unravel the problem in

33
00:02:03,656 --> 00:02:08,799
the house of Atreus of without committing
more crimes that's going to provoke even

34
00:02:08,799 --> 00:02:12,527
more retribution.
It is incumbent upon Orestes to kill his

35
00:02:12,527 --> 00:02:15,934
father's murderer.
That would be widely understood in

36
00:02:15,934 --> 00:02:18,570
antiquity.
If someone murders your father,

37
00:02:18,570 --> 00:02:21,111
Gosh,
Heaven forbid, it's up to you!

38
00:02:21,111 --> 00:02:26,399
You need to be the one that executes
justice to take care of the murderer.

39
00:02:26,605 --> 00:02:32,031
If family members just decided not to do
that, well, it would not only be, you

40
00:02:32,031 --> 00:02:37,663
know, a little, a little sad, but it would
be a great source of shame for the family.

41
00:02:37,663 --> 00:02:39,715
It,
And gosh if someone did that your family,

42
00:02:39,715 --> 00:02:43,624
you'd have to take action.
Orestes is forced in a position now of

43
00:02:43,624 --> 00:02:46,191
taking revenge against his father's
murder.

44
00:02:46,191 --> 00:02:50,266
But now, what happens when the act of
revenge is itself going to be crime

45
00:02:50,266 --> 00:02:53,727
against the family?
Orestes has to kill his own mother now to,

46
00:02:53,727 --> 00:02:57,970
to try avenge the murder of his father.
This is where things start to get

47
00:02:57,970 --> 00:03:01,542
especially, specially ugly.
How are we going to wash this curse out?

48
00:03:01,542 --> 00:03:05,226
How we can get rid of it?
Now, justice has a couple of different

49
00:03:05,394 --> 00:03:09,748
ways that we might think about. The
balance is often times tossed out as being

50
00:03:09,748 --> 00:03:14,077
sort of core here, we've got an extra
wrinkle tossed in. As on the one side of

51
00:03:14,077 --> 00:03:19,283
the scale of justice, we've got our gavel
in, indicating regular old courtroom

52
00:03:19,283 --> 00:03:22,717
justice.
On the other side, we've got the gun and

53
00:03:22,717 --> 00:03:27,834
again taking justice into your own hands.
So, where exactly are we going to find

54
00:03:27,834 --> 00:03:31,862
justice in this scheme?
Would it be in a building like this.

55
00:03:31,862 --> 00:03:35,204
Notice it's Romanesque architecture based
on Greek presidents.

56
00:03:35,365 --> 00:03:39,678
Would it be in a building like this?
Well, for the Greeks were kind of looking

57
00:03:39,678 --> 00:03:43,667
at a time when such a thing might be
possible, such a thing might actually

58
00:03:43,667 --> 00:03:46,793
start to happen.
We'll see when we get to the humanities

59
00:03:46,793 --> 00:03:51,429
that our story is actually going to move
toward a concept of justice that is going

60
00:03:51,429 --> 00:03:55,526
to be recog, more recognizable from the
modern frame than the one we've been

61
00:03:55,526 --> 00:03:59,300
talking about up till' now.
In order to get a grip on what we've been.

62
00:03:59,300 --> 00:04:04,900
Talking about in this story,
We need to anchor ourself in a really

63
00:04:04,900 --> 00:04:09,490
important ancient concept.
That is the concept of miasma.

64
00:04:09,490 --> 00:04:15,546
I put it here in very small print for
dramatic effect because it is an outsized

65
00:04:15,546 --> 00:04:18,684
and hugely important concept in this
story.

66
00:04:18,684 --> 00:04:23,500
Miasma is a Greek term that means a kind
of cloud of pollution.

67
00:04:23,500 --> 00:04:28,063
It's a cloud of pollution.
And a miasma would hover around a corpse.

68
00:04:28,261 --> 00:04:34,081
Someone that was killed, someone who had a
violent episode of death that visited upon

69
00:04:34,081 --> 00:04:37,123
them,
Their corpse would be surrounded by this

70
00:04:37,520 --> 00:04:41,879
cloud of nasty, toxic stuff.
Now, if someone who was, you know, engaged

71
00:04:41,879 --> 00:04:46,239
in that killing, they would have this
miasma stuck on them.

72
00:04:46,239 --> 00:04:51,050
They would be impure.
The guilt would stick to them like a stain

73
00:04:51,050 --> 00:04:55,786
and it would be very clear who it was that
committed the crime.

74
00:04:55,786 --> 00:05:01,047
The, the stick of this nastiness gets
stuck onto them. And now, because they

75
00:05:01,047 --> 00:05:04,881
have that nastiness on them, they are
indeed guilty.

76
00:05:04,881 --> 00:05:08,339
They're subject to retribution and
punishment.

77
00:05:08,339 --> 00:05:13,824
It just so happens that it could take
place that, someone else, who has nothing

78
00:05:13,824 --> 00:05:19,567
to do with the murder just happens by that
corpse and comes in contact with the cloud

79
00:05:19,567 --> 00:05:23,240
of miasma that surrounds it and they get
stained by it,

80
00:05:23,240 --> 00:05:28,240
Well, that person who had got that part of
a stain on them would now become subject

81
00:05:28,240 --> 00:05:32,660
to retribution and subject to revenge.
Even though they hadn't done anything.

82
00:05:32,660 --> 00:05:37,671
The Greeks imagined that this revenge was
triggered by these kind of elemental

83
00:05:37,671 --> 00:05:40,398
forces,
Physicalist with physical manifestations

84
00:05:40,398 --> 00:05:45,092
built into the environment around us.
For the cases of murder, those forces

85
00:05:45,092 --> 00:05:50,104
would lead toward retribution that was
clearly built into the actions that the

86
00:05:50,104 --> 00:05:54,734
person himself, him or herself had taken.
But, for someone who just happened across

87
00:05:54,734 --> 00:05:59,618
it and guiltlessly ran into a polluted
corpse, well now, revenge would also be

88
00:05:59,618 --> 00:06:02,663
visited upon them and they would suffer
greatly.

89
00:06:02,663 --> 00:06:08,066
And it wouldn't be clear what kind of
actions they had done to provoke this. one

90
00:06:08,066 --> 00:06:13,320
asks oneself in this particular with this
concept, as a core, what,

91
00:06:13,320 --> 00:06:17,207
How, how just is that?
How, how much does this count as justice?

92
00:06:17,398 --> 00:06:22,177
Well the, the concept of miasma doesn't
actually equate to ideas of justice.

93
00:06:22,177 --> 00:06:27,275
But what is does is give us a background
to try to think about how they imagine

94
00:06:27,275 --> 00:06:31,293
justice might take place.
The theory that surrounds miasma gives us

95
00:06:31,293 --> 00:06:35,708
a window into how people make explanations
when bad things start happening to good

96
00:06:35,708 --> 00:06:38,208
people.
When bad things start happening to good

97
00:06:38,208 --> 00:06:40,442
people.
Those of us who think that, well, you get

98
00:06:40,442 --> 00:06:44,378
those just desserts, those who commit
crimes get punished for those crimes.

99
00:06:44,378 --> 00:06:48,261
We imagine ourselves thinking, yeah. Well,
if they're getting punished, there's

100
00:06:48,261 --> 00:06:51,080
probably good reason.
They probably committed a crime.

101
00:06:51,080 --> 00:06:53,580
And now bad things are going to happen to
them.

102
00:06:53,580 --> 00:06:57,782
The Greeks, on the other hand, have a very
different, sort of central notion here.

103
00:06:57,782 --> 00:07:00,441
If someone's getting punished, what does
that mean?

104
00:07:00,441 --> 00:07:03,758
It means that they have pollution.
It means that they have pollution.

105
00:07:03,758 --> 00:07:07,192
That's what happened to them.
Now, that pollution always raises the

106
00:07:07,192 --> 00:07:11,353
possibility that, yeah, they were engaged
in some nasty action, and therefore were

107
00:07:11,353 --> 00:07:15,463
polluted, because they touched a corpse.
But it also raises the possibility that

108
00:07:15,463 --> 00:07:19,677
someone, through no fault of their own,
just happened by there got polluted and so

109
00:07:19,677 --> 00:07:24,272
they're getting revenge against them even
though they didn't deserve it.

110
00:07:24,272 --> 00:07:29,639
So, the Greek concept of miasma builds in
just retribution as well as retribution

111
00:07:29,639 --> 00:07:33,983
that doesn't quite seem so just.
It's part and parcel of how they

112
00:07:33,983 --> 00:07:39,157
understand all of revenge to be happening.
It's connected to this nasty pollution

113
00:07:39,157 --> 00:07:43,501
that gets visited upon people.
Now, all the things that get connected

114
00:07:43,501 --> 00:07:47,972
with miasma, evil, guilt, stain,
pollution, similarly, also toxicness,

115
00:07:48,164 --> 00:07:53,913
drugs that might kill you, in other words,
some kind of awfulness that could be

116
00:07:53,913 --> 00:07:59,479
visited upon you, inability to wash out a
stain. Attempts at purification that don't

117
00:07:59,479 --> 00:08:03,405
get worked out.
All these are coursing around themes that

118
00:08:03,405 --> 00:08:09,189
are anchored to this Greek idea of miasma.
In fact, Agamemnon is working with a sense

119
00:08:09,189 --> 00:08:14,699
of justice that's built around ideas of
revenge, miasma built into the blood, and

120
00:08:14,699 --> 00:08:18,900
all these things connected together
through this concept.

121
00:08:18,900 --> 00:08:21,602
Now, what happens as Aeschylus is doing
this,

122
00:08:21,602 --> 00:08:26,640
He's portraying for us, as the Greeks that
we are, witnessing this in the classical

123
00:08:26,640 --> 00:08:29,527
period.
An idea of justice that would have been

124
00:08:29,527 --> 00:08:34,073
anchored in ancient mythic times.
When Aeschylus is writing this, there are

125
00:08:34,073 --> 00:08:38,988
other ideas of justice that are starting
to come around that aren't necessarily

126
00:08:38,988 --> 00:08:44,086
just based on personal familial revenge
anchored around this concept of miasma and

127
00:08:44,086 --> 00:08:48,939
floating guilt that might be connected
someone who deserves it and someone who

128
00:08:48,939 --> 00:08:51,704
doesn't.
Here in the, the concept over here, we've

129
00:08:51,704 --> 00:08:56,489
got connection to blood, right?
The, the blood of the corpse causes this

130
00:08:56,489 --> 00:09:01,149
awful stench around it, and that stench
can get rubbed off on other people,

131
00:09:01,149 --> 00:09:03,933
It has a sort of elemental, tactile feel
to it.

132
00:09:04,114 --> 00:09:10,559
That, that is the marker of when just
desserts are visited upon someone whether

133
00:09:10,559 --> 00:09:14,728
they're just or unjust is whether they
have this pollution against them.

134
00:09:14,728 --> 00:09:19,499
So, pollution here is anchored to a notion
of blood. Blood just as we're talking

135
00:09:19,499 --> 00:09:25,241
about with blood ties within families,
we've got an idea of a connection between

136
00:09:25,241 --> 00:09:30,114
people that can be supportive on some,
some senses, when family can be that way

137
00:09:30,114 --> 00:09:34,587
can also be quite nasty.
And when the blood itself becomes polluted

138
00:09:34,587 --> 00:09:39,661
and diseased, then inside the family, a
kind of polluted miasma of disease is

139
00:09:39,661 --> 00:09:42,732
being sent down from generation to
generation.

140
00:09:42,732 --> 00:09:47,272
Just as they share blood, they're also
going to share this pollution.

141
00:09:47,272 --> 00:09:52,495
Now, within this system, it gets very hard
to figure out how in the world someone

142
00:09:52,495 --> 00:09:56,507
could solve the problem of bringing
justice to the family of Atreus.

143
00:09:56,507 --> 00:10:01,045
How in the world are we going to get this
curse out when it's built into our own

144
00:10:01,045 --> 00:10:03,790
blood?
We're going to see that Aeschylus is going

145
00:10:03,790 --> 00:10:08,384
to present for us a completely different
idea of justice that's going to be based

146
00:10:08,384 --> 00:10:12,250
on some brand new concepts that are
emerging in the classical period.

147
00:10:12,250 --> 00:10:16,508
It's going to help us solve what in mythic
times, you and I, classical Greeks

148
00:10:16,508 --> 00:10:20,934
remember, these mythic times way back
before us, what in mythic times was a very

149
00:10:20,934 --> 00:10:24,463
hard thing to solve.
It's a knotty problem in the family of the

150
00:10:24,463 --> 00:10:28,069
house of Atreus.
Our own classical time, the modern Greek

151
00:10:28,069 --> 00:10:33,826
classical time that we know, is going to
have a solution for us as we move forward

152
00:10:33,826 --> 00:10:37,620
into Aeschylus's theories a play called
Humanities.